Speaker 1:

Welcome to The Parenting Without Power Struggles podcast. Today you're gonna hear me coaching a new parent who is sharing the challenges she's facing as she adjusts to life with a baby. We're gonna get started in a minute, but first, hi there. I'm Susan Stiffelman. I'm your host and the author of Parenting Without Power Struggles and Parenting With Presence. In this podcast, I get to share some of the things I've learned in the 40 something years that I've been a marriage and family therapist, a teacher, parent educator, and a mom. And we cover everything here with guests like Ned Hallowell, Laura Markham, Debbie Reber, Maggie Dent, Mona Delahooke, and many other wise and wonderful speakers. Before we get started, please visit susanstiffelman.com. There you'll find a free newsletter with lots of inspiration and strategies, and over 40 deep dive masterclasses on everything from chores and homework to creating sane routines and helping anxious children thrive.

Speaker 1:

There's really something for everyone there. And you'll also find information about my class with Dr. Dan Siegel on generational healing tools for breaking dysfunctional patterns. And you'll learn more about the class I just did recently with Dr. Gabor Mate. So head over to susanstiffelman.com to learn more. In today's session, I'm talking with a new mom about some of the less openly discussed aspects of having a little one. I loved this conversation so much. This mom was so brave and so honest about some of the challenges that come with being tethered to a new baby and some of the adjustment that's needed. And that's hard as our identity as an individual gets absorbed into the needs of our children. Have a listen and we'll come back for the wrap up. Hi there. And I'm really excited to hear about your situation and see if I can offer a little bit of help.

Speaker 2:

Thank you so much. I appreciate it. So what's going on with me is my partner and I have an 11 month old baby. And our relationship before the baby came was very smooth and equal and a really fun time. And so I think we naively believed that that would just continuance the baby came and we wouldn't face the challenges that we hear about from other parents. And in reality, what's happened is the qual balance of of tasks and responsibilities related to the baby is quite difficult. And creating some feelings of resentment in me. And and I think confusion too, because I, we've never had anything, we've never had anything like this create this kind of challenge in our relationship before. And I, and I thought we, I guess we thought we had like, planned for it or had the right conversations or <laugh>, you know, done what we could and, and still it just feels uneven and I, and I don't really know how to hold that.

Speaker 1:

Okay. And who's working? You know, like is there a designated primary caregiver for the baby as opposed to person earning? Mm-Hmm.

Speaker 2:

<Affirmative>. Yeah. So I'm the primary caregiver and my partner is the earner. I work a little bit, but it's, it's very minimal.

Speaker 1:

Okay. And was there a discussion about the distribution of tasks? Not that you could have known. You know, you could say, well, who's gonna change the baby feed the baby shop for the baby? And those are just <laugh>, like the, the big, you know, ticket items, but then there's thousands of smaller ones. So what kind of conversation did you have knowing in advance you couldn't have known about the gazillion small, little microscopic, but meaningful tasks associated, but what, did you come to some discussion or agreement ahead of time? Or did you just figure it would work out and you'd talk about things as the, as they unfolded?

Speaker 2:

Yeah, I, I think there was a very general conversation that, you know, since I was winding down my money earning work, that my full focus would be on the baby and, and then my partner would fill in as needed. I think there was some like sense of trust that we'll figure it out. We've got it, we'll address things as they come up. Okay. But we didn't really drill down to the, to the details to like pre-negotiated the details.

Speaker 1:

No. And nor could you really, I mean, you know, and is this a biological baby? Did one of you carry the baby?

Speaker 2:

Yes, I did. Okay.

Speaker 1:

Yeah.

Speaker 2:

Okay.

Speaker 1:

So if we look underneath sort of the manifestation of this that's causing the resentment, I'm guessing it has to do with who's waking up with the baby, who's sort of dragging themself out of bed if the baby wakes up or if the baby just needs care and attention and you're depleted you know, did what is the need under it? Is it a need to feel that you have sort of a an equally invested partner? Is it a need for sleep? Is it a need for appreciation? Is it a need? You know, if you could get into the weeds a little bit and and what is the need that is not being met right now by your partner?

Speaker 2:

Hmm. Well, I, I think I'd say the need is something about my freedom and autonomy. And, and, and that's not something that I think my partner can necessarily give me. They can support me in seeking it, but but, you know, I'm also breastfeeding and and bed sharing with the baby. So I'm, I'm not getting a lot, I don't have a lot of physical, you know, I'm kind of tethered to the baby physically, right. Like every few hours I need to be back. And so that setup that we've agreed upon and, and I consent to just kind, it keeps me so close and there's a trapped feeling that that comes outta that. Yeah. Right. Yeah. And so, so I think that the underlying need for me is freedom and autonomy. Like I, I went, I had a, a mild medical issue and I needed to go to the emergency room for eight hours. And that was just terrifying. Mostly knowing that, like, what are they gonna do without me? And, and so the lasting impact of that has been like this resentment like, God, I can't even go to the emergency room <laugh>, you know, and and none of that is my partner, my partner's fault or anything like that, you know, that, that, but I think that yeah, the setup is, is just one that leaves me feeling not free. And, and, yeah.

Speaker 1:

Yeah. Yeah. I'm listening to you and my heart is soft, and I'm not only hearing you talk about this feeling of kind of feeling trapped and not, you know, I don't hear anything negative. I clearly, you're, you're a caring parent, but that feeling of, you know, being tethered to the baby and not having that kind of freedom and autonomy and the ability to even go away for eight hours for medical issues and not be, you know, feeling this elastic pull or this fear worry. And as I listen, I'm imagining the thousands of parents hearing this who have a new or newish baby identifying with what you're saying. Mm-Hmm. <affirmative>. And I think it's one of the things that we don't understand ahead of time about what it's gonna, what raising a child is about. And it, and, and I don't wanna freak you out or anything, and this will change, it will change in the reasonably near future for you in terms of some of it.

Speaker 1:

Mm-Hmm. <Affirmative> where you'll be able to have longer stretches of time when once you're not nursing, and you can hire a sitter, you know, if your partner can't spell you and give you that time. But it is true that nobody really understands the depth of entwinement and em measurement <laugh>. Mm. Not in an unhealthy way. I have a child, a child <laugh>, who's 33, and I'm still very aware many days of, you know, how's he doing? And what, how are they, you know? Mm-Hmm. <Affirmative>, there's just a way that we are re reconstructed. And I don't know if we ever go back to who we were before. I don't think it's possible to go back to who we were with that kind of carefree, unburdened sense that we're moving through the world as a single separate person. Does that make sense to you? Sorry, <laugh>.

Speaker 2:

Yes, absolutely. It does. It does. And I think, you know, it's in the late nights that that realization kind of comes crashing down on me and can, you know, it can, can evoke a feeling of panic in some way. Yeah.

Speaker 1:

And

Speaker 2:

And you know, and of course I love my child and I'm, and I'm so glad that we made this decision and all that, but the, but there's something that feels inescapable about it that, that yeah. Creates a lot of yeah. Panic and and fear in me. Yeah.

Speaker 1:

And also, you know, there is, you know, postnatal depression, you know, that Mm-Hmm. <Affirmative>, a adjustment to that is, is no joke. And I would hope that if you sort of teeter on the edge of some depressive experiences or feeling flattened by the overwhelming demands, that you're getting some support outside of your partner who can only go so far with you and who can only offer so much if you're depressed. And I won't ask you 'cause this is a public forum, but if you were feeling depressed or feeling I can't do this, or, you know, having fantasies or images that aren't, are worrisome in any way, please, please make sure that you're reaching out. There are so many wonderful networks of support just for postpartum, but also for, you know, therapy and, and those who specialize because I, I I, I'm sorry you're going through this, but I'm really grateful that we're talking about it in this podcast because we don't talk about it a lot. Mm-Hmm. <affirmative>. And I think that the glorification of what it is to become a mother and to raise a child, and to be a parent, and it is, it's, you know, you can't even describe the changes and the beauty and the moments of tenderness and sweetness, but it's also really hard. Mm-Hmm.

Speaker 2:

<Affirmative>.

Speaker 1:

And so if you're, some of what I think we have to come to, if, if you're not experiencing real postpartum or, or depression is grief for the life you have lost, it's, there's a, a grief for what you're watching, almost like watching a ship sail off into the distance. Hmm. And knowing you're not on it anymore, and you may have friends still, I don't know if you still have friends in your circle who are autonomous and free and doing kind of cool fun things that you maybe don't see yourself doing for a while. Is that, is that also part of it?

Speaker 2:

Absolutely. I mean, you know, it's like my whole world changed when I had the baby, but honestly, there's a second life that I have online with social media and everything, and that didn't change really. Like sure, I'm following a few more parenting, you know, influencers or whatever, but all my friends, like, they're still going to the same parties. They're still vacationing, they're still doing. And so there's been a real dissonance there for me. And it really highlights that feeling of being left out. And like my life has, has kinda ground to a halt in some ways. Yeah. Yeah. And everything else keeps going on. And so, you know, as we bring this up here, I'm thinking it might be worth it to make, to do a more intentional shift there of like what I am exposing myself to. Like I maybe don't need to see what all the cool parties are that I'm not gonna go to every weekend. <Laugh>.

Speaker 1:

Yeah. I, I'm so touched by how kind of brave you are and how honest you are. You know, a lot of parents are go through something similar, but they're not tuning into it, so it's getting pushed down and repressed. Mm-Hmm. <affirmative>. And then it just shows up in explosive anger or in detaching, maybe from the baby, or, you know, so what you're doing is really healthy, even though it's so hard,

Speaker 2:

<Laugh>

Speaker 1:

Just to be more present and aware this is what's going on right now, and I'm, I'm looking at it, I'm not hiding from it.

Speaker 2:

Hmm.

Speaker 1:

It might be interesting, and I know we're, these are supposed to just be brief little vignette, and it's always really hard for me to wrap up because I, I feel like I start to just get going here. And of course you could be part of our membership and we do go deeper, but I wonder if it would be helpful for you to do some reflecting after our conversation. If you have a few more minutes, maybe take some notes or record something free freeform, like unstructured, you know, just kind of a brain dump about some of the things that might be getting stirred up around all of this that you could coalesce into a letter or an expression or something you read to your partner that takes them a little bit out of the position of having to, you know, feeling they're failing you because they're not, they're not able to and they're just not able perhaps. Mm-Hmm. To give you more a longer leash. Mm-Hmm.

Speaker 2:

<Affirmative>. Mm-Hmm. <affirmative>

Speaker 1:

That puts you guys back on the same side. Mm-Hmm. <affirmative>. That, that your partner is there as a support, if nothing else, to witness and, and comfort you. Mm-Hmm. <Affirmative>. And, and really the word that comes up for me and you, and I hope people don't misunderstand that is grief.

Speaker 2:

Yeah.

Speaker 1:

You're describing a grieving process for what you had and don't have right now.

Speaker 2:

Absolutely.

Speaker 1:

And maybe your partner can hold you while you cry about this. Mm-Hmm. <Affirmative>. And that underneath the resentment and anger and frustration, and this is unfair and it's inequitable and for sure you might negotiate, listen on Saturdays I wanna sleep in, I want you to take the baby. I will have nurse the baby at 5:00 AM and then I want till noon or whatever. Mm-Hmm. <Affirmative>. Mm-Hmm. <affirmative> you may wanna have, but I would have that negotiating the practicalities of this after there's a genuine connection where, where you feel that your partner, that the two of you feel you're on the same side here. Mm-Hmm. <Affirmative>. And there's been kind of a, a, an, a vulnerability expressed and that you offer that to your partner who might be able to say, listen, I've watched you struggle. I feel I'm doing all I can. Maybe I have a little bit of ga Yeah. I could go a little further, but this has been hard for me to witness your, your, the change for you that's been hard to adapt to and to feel that you're mad at me. 'cause I can't make it all go away. Mm-Hmm. <Affirmative>. So it might be that a really open and honest conversation, perhaps facilitated by a therapist would be helpful as well. Mm-Hmm.

Speaker 2:

<Affirmative>, that sounds really beautiful.

Speaker 1:

Good. Any, any kind of wrapping up ways you wanna kind of, any thoughts as we bring this to a close?

Speaker 2:

I I just wanna appreciate that we're able to tell the truth here. Yeah. Thank you.

Speaker 1:

That's the whole point. You know, I think parents are exposed to way too much material, you know, podcasts, Instagram, all of it. Mm-Hmm. That leave them feeling what's wrong with me? Mm-Hmm. <affirmative>, what am I doing wrong? And I'm so not into that because I, I've done this, I've had people come in my office for over 40 years and close the door and tell the, the truth about what their struggles are. And of course, I never ever divulged anybody's private thoughts, but it has accumulated for me to this very powerful understanding that we need to tell the truth. Because too many people don't know that everybody else is struggling too. Almost everybody, even the ones who look or really put together and smiling and, you know, you hear that, oh, not everything is an Instagram story, but for real, Uhhuh <affirmative>, the people who are posing, you know, posting are, you know, maybe shutting off the camera and screaming at their kids or going into the bathroom and crying on the floor. It's just, it's hard. It's hard to raise another human being and nobody tells you, kind of as you're so beautifully describing how, just the shock of, oh, I don't have a life of my own exactly. Anymore. I still do. And you have to have that Your baby will benefit from you having some autonomy and freedom and, and getting nourished from other places besides home and baby partner.

Speaker 1:

But let's start with the truth. So thank you so, so much for doing that.

Speaker 2:

Mm-Hmm, <affirmative>, thank you.

Speaker 1:

I hope you enjoyed that. And perhaps you could relate whether you have a new baby or you just have kids that there can be a, a part of us that sort of longs for the version of us that we were before we became so identified with being a parent. And of course, there's always possibility of frustration and conflict between partners if one feels they're doing more than the other and that that's a problem that's usually never fully solved. But certainly conversation, open discussion and compromise and listening can go a long way toward helping people feel that they're a team. I really loved her honesty. And anyway, hope you found it useful. If you're finding these episodes valuable, I would so appreciate it. If you would just take about 30 seconds to leave a rating and even a review takes maybe a minute or two to write something about how you've been affected or something you might've learned from one of the episodes here. And as always, just stay in touch. You can visit susanstiffelman.com for information about my upcoming classes, Dr. Dan Siegel, classes with Dr. Gabor Mate, Maggie Dent, we're about to do something together. Lots of great support for you there. And of course, the free newsletter. So stay in touch. And now as we wrap up, just a, a simple reminder, but potentially one that could really make a difference in your day. Remember, no matter how busy life gets, look for those moments of sweetness and joy. Stay well, take care and I'll see you next time.